Hubzilla

JRandal

Brazil, Sun, 14 May 2017 21:02:18 +0100

Don't know what I'll go to after my old MacBook gives out, but I can't see myself ever going back to Windows. I'd love to go to some Linux something-or-other, but I don't have the smarts to install or to do upkeep on it. Ran across the Elementary OS site, which I know nothing about, but looks cool, and that got me to thinking about my OS future again. #technology

show all 46 comments

Fraengii

Mon, 15 May 2017 19:57:47 +0100

Linux is a good choice!
I'm running ubuntustudio on my 4.1 MacBook (so I have a actual OS on it ^^), but I recommend Linux Mint which works much better with the Apple hardware although they are both based on Ubuntu.

Maria Karlsen

Mon, 15 May 2017 20:05:05 +0100

:heart: Debian!

JRandal

Mon, 15 May 2017 22:42:51 +0100

Uh oh, are the Linux wars starting here? :)

I saw somebody recommend Linux Lite for beginners. I'm a pre-pre-beginner.

giac hellvecio

Tue, 16 May 2017 01:20:12 +0100

meu amigo, melhor usar um linux estável e com uma boa comunidade, de maneira a não ter problemas.
na minha opinião : debian ou ubuntu (kubuntu ou outro tipo xubuntu...) ou linux-mint ou opensuse, o resto não me arriscaria .

JRandal

Tue, 16 May 2017 01:45:56 +0100

Obrigado pela dica. Se uma hora eu for nessa direção, vou ter que comprar um aparelho com o OS já instalado. Aí vou recorrer a você e outros no Brasil, para não ter problem quanto ao teclado em português. No MacBook, estou usando o teclado de Portugal, pois o brasileiro tem mais teclas do que o teclado do Mac se não me engano.

Maria Karlsen

Wed, 17 May 2017 08:44:10 +0100 last edited: Wed, 17 May 2017 08:44:53 +0100

@JRandal If you don't plan to use your old computer for anything important, I suggest you keep it for a while and use it for experiments and learning. Download some Linux .isos and start installing and reinstalling and have some fun!

As for being pre-beginner: I started using Linux when Win98/ME was outdated...I learned by doing LOTS of mistakes, and by asking questions in linux forums. I still count myself as a beginner.... but I am using it on a daily basis and don't really want anything else

JRandal

Wed, 17 May 2017 10:13:12 +0100

@Maria Karlsen Good suggestion. Not sure what I'll do with it at this point. I bought it refurbished and have done some updates, but it's probably 8-10 years old. Not sure anybody would want it. Oh, and one day I had left my backpack unzipped and when I pulled it out of the car to sling it on my shoulder the laptop went flying and landed on the stone floor. I was sure it was broken and ruined, but when I opened it, it worked fine. No shattered screen, either. Gotta say that for a Mac product.

I know next to nothing about computers. Don't even do command line.

Maria Karlsen

Wed, 17 May 2017 11:25:27 +0100

Good thing about Linux: You can choose to do everything at the commandline. Or (almost) everything in a user interface (there are plenty to choose from). Or anything inbetween, depending on your skill level and on what you prefer. Personally I think the Mate environment is a good choice, with a nice looking easy to use interface and still with access to the command line if you need it.

JRandal

Wed, 17 May 2017 18:06:58 +0100

Beyond me...

Maria Karlsen

Wed, 17 May 2017 18:24:01 +0100 last edited: Wed, 17 May 2017 18:32:37 +0100

Sorry. I don't know much about MacOS, but in Linux you have several choices of graphical desktop environments (user interfaces) using the same underlaying OS. You pick one and try it out, and if you don't like it you can just install a new (user interface) without having to reinstall everything. It's actually very convenient

For a starter I would recommend Mate, Trinity or Xfce as reasonable choices. I would avoid the default Gnome 3, but that's just my own humble opinion.

JRandal

Wed, 17 May 2017 18:43:58 +0100

Gotcha. Kinda like themes for a WP installation. (My analogy to get a grasp on it.)

Fraengii

Wed, 17 May 2017 19:27:08 +0100

Beyond me...

you wrote, @JRandal Don't fear Linux. By now it is far beyond the geek thing. The distributions about which we talked are all very userfriendly. And you can test them as live systems without installing.

Maria Karlsen

Wed, 17 May 2017 19:33:07 +0100 last edited: Wed, 17 May 2017 19:37:46 +0100

And as for picking a distribution (Linux variant that is): A common advice is to choose the one that you can most easily get support from (meaning what your friends/relatives/connections know and use).

#^https://distrowatch.com/ (Just don't get overwhelmed

)
#^https://www.howtogeek.com/191207/10-of-the-most-popular-linux-distributions-compared/

Personally I started with Suse but have since mostly run Debian.

JRandal

Wed, 17 May 2017 20:07:13 +0100

@Fraengii That option to test without installing sounds good. How would I go about that?

@Maria Karlsen Good point, in terms of most easily getting support. Here, I don't know anybody that uses Linux of any sort. :(

Fraengii

Wed, 17 May 2017 20:12:49 +0100

I started with SuSE too. Than I switched to Ubuntu, than Mint. By now I use Debian and Ubuntu (Ubuntustudio on my old MacBook).
But I would recommend Mint with Cinnamon or Maté as Desktop. I've installed it for my girlfriend on her laptop and she has no problems to use it - and she is the diametrical opposite of an IT geek.

And we are with you!!!

JRandal

Wed, 17 May 2017 20:17:00 +0100

Thanks, I appreciate the kind suggestions and ideas.

Fraengii

Wed, 17 May 2017 20:18:23 +0100

@Maria Karlsen , what do you think about Linux-Mint with Maté?

Maria Karlsen

Wed, 17 May 2017 20:18:55 +0100 last edited: Wed, 17 May 2017 20:19:25 +0100

Fear not @JRandal , I have a feeling you'll find more than one linux user around Hubzilla

. I am no expert but I'm happy to help with what I can.

Maria Karlsen

Wed, 17 May 2017 20:29:56 +0100 last edited: Thu, 18 May 2017 20:39:25 +0100

@Fraengii I have no other experience from Mint than a Live DVD that my (at that time) old computer couldn't really handle. I've tried Ubuntu briefly but quickly went back to Debian which is my favourite this far. Mate seems like a really good choice - and not so far off from the standard MacOS interface I believe. Actually, anything deb-based would work I guess.

Fraengii

Thu, 18 May 2017 21:17:42 +0100

Sorry that I quit our talk so uncommented yesterday, the battery of my computer runs empty and then there was my girlfriend and it was late and ....

@JRandal, it depends a little on your hardware which distro you choose: For old and week hardware your should try lubuntu with the lxde desktop which is also quite nice but simple and not fancy anyway.
For more powerful hardware you may choose Linux-Mint with Maté.

So what do you have or will buy?

JRandal

Thu, 18 May 2017 23:45:32 +0100

@Fraengii No problem. Life gets in the way sometimes.

I'm just now beginning to think about all this. My MacBook is probably 10 years old. (The wife says 7-8 years, I think it's more.) And I bought it refurbished. Has done great. But I can see a time coming soon when I'll need to move to a new machine.

I'll need the option to have a Portuguese keyboard. So that's a concern. In my MacBook, I have an option in the tool bar to select the language keyboard. (I leave it on the Portugal option, since the Brazilian one needs extra keys for accents.)

I'm thinking of getting new hardware and keeping my MacBook for the time being until I'm sure the new laptop is working well. So that was why I was thinking of buying something preinstalled. I do some books and pubs, but all done in LibreOffice. My demands aren't great, therefore.

So to answer your question: I plan on buying, if I can swing it. No idea yet of what to get.

Fraengii

Fri, 19 May 2017 06:55:36 +0100

Has your MacBook an Intel processor? And which architecture does it have, 32b or 64b?
You find those information's in the apple menus, there you find something like "About this computer".

Fraengii

Fri, 19 May 2017 07:23:41 +0100

Regarding that localisation (Portuguese keyboard layout, Portuguese menues, .. ) I think all those distros we've talked about are fully supported.

JRandal

Fri, 19 May 2017 10:33:11 +0100

2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo. 4 GB 1067 MHz DDR3. Architecture I did not see anywhere.

151 GB free of 249 GB.

It's a late 2008 model, so I guess my wife was closer in her estimate: I've probably had it some 8 years.

Great news on the Portuguese keyboard layout.

Maria Karlsen

Fri, 19 May 2017 14:53:03 +0100

Don't worry about your hardware, I've just tried Debian on an ancient 1,1 Mhz pc with 512 MB RAM. I got almost everything to run well enough (with a fairly minimal installation) - apart from browsing picture heavy websites that made it choke. Yours should be good enough for at least MATE/Xfce/LXDE. It's probably not necessary, but you could consider adding some more RAM if anything.
And as Fraengii said, most distributions are multi-language, so you just take your pick during the installation

Maria Karlsen

Fri, 19 May 2017 14:57:10 +0100

One thing to consider (for the installation) is the quality and speed of your internet connection. You can download either a full set of CD/DVS:s to install from, or a minimal CD that will download what's missing on it from the internet during installation. The disc images can also be written to a bootable usb if you prefer that.

JRandal

Fri, 19 May 2017 15:31:04 +0100

My CD/DVD drive isn't working anymore, so it'd have to be from the internet. I imagine the connection ought to do OK.

I'd prefer to do the installation in English, but select a keyboard layout in Portuguese. :)

James Lamentus

Fri, 19 May 2017 15:39:07 +0100

your notebook is 'brazilian keyboard' or 'american' ? do not talk about layout but the hardware.

JRandal

Fri, 19 May 2017 16:39:11 +0100

@James Lamentus The laptop itself is American, but whatever OS I use MUST have a Portuguese keyboard layout that gives me access to all accents.

James Lamentus

Fri, 19 May 2017 16:42:23 +0100

I personally do not like to use a different layout than the hardware,
but if you are used, there are no problems, you can choose what you want in a linux.

James Lamentus

Fri, 19 May 2017 16:54:54 +0100

editing the Fraengii 's comment:
Regarding that localisation (Portuguese-br keyboard layout, Portuguese-br menues, .. ) I know all those distros we've talked about are fully supported.

Fraengii

Fri, 19 May 2017 17:20:24 +0100

I always used the term layout for the key map. Is this really that wrong?
I think it is also used in setting dialogues, isn't it?

Fraengii

Fri, 19 May 2017 17:34:53 +0100 last edited: Fri, 19 May 2017 17:36:08 +0100

O, I suppose I missunderstood something..

James Lamentus

Fri, 19 May 2017 17:47:18 +0100

I just wanted to know the type of 'hardware keyboard' he had, because it is tiring to use an hardware k. different from the 'keyboard layout' , I did this in the past.

James Lamentus

Fri, 19 May 2017 17:56:17 +0100

for ex. an american laptop has a different keyboard comparing with a brazilian laptop, so is not so 'nice' using an 'american keyboard' configured as a 'brazilian keyboard' ( you can do this without problem in linux but is tiring).

Maria Karlsen

Fri, 19 May 2017 18:34:38 +0100 last edited: Fri, 19 May 2017 18:34:39 +0100

My CD/DVD drive isn't working anymore

If you wish, it's possible to put a bootable CD image on an usb stick. (Your computer needs to be able to boot from usb to use it).

I'd prefer to do the installation in English, but select a keyboard layout in Portuguese. :)

You can pick any language for the installation. You can pick any language for the user interface/desktop environment. You can pick any language for the keyboard layout. You can even choose to install more than one language for the user interface and more than one keyboard layout, and switch freely between them. (I have both Swedish and Norwegian keyboard layouts installed and can switch between them using a keystroke or a mouseclick.)

JRandal

Fri, 19 May 2017 20:33:45 +0100

James is right about the Brazilian keyboard layout, it has extra keys, that's why on the MacBook I chose the Portugal layout, which is different from the Brazilian, so I can get to one accent that doesn't have a key in the latter.

Off to work out.

Maria Karlsen

Sun, 21 May 2017 01:25:07 +0100 last edited: Sun, 21 May 2017 19:34:31 +0100

I think you can handle this @JRandal :
https://sparklechicken.net/cloud/shimriez/Videos/debian_mate_netinstall_strauss.ogg
(I downloaded the iso file from here: #^https://www.debian.org/distrib/netinst)

JRandal

Sun, 21 May 2017 01:42:02 +0100

@Maria Karlsen , thank you. First, I need to get me a machine to install it on. I'm afraid to tinker with my MacBook, since it's my only hardware, my daily worktool, and I can't risk messing it up.

Fraengii

Sun, 21 May 2017 08:00:33 +0100

The Problem is that you habe no CD drive because as far as I know there is no way to start a MacBook from a USB stick.
Another way to try Linux is to install it in Virtualbox.

Maria Karlsen

Sun, 21 May 2017 10:12:33 +0100

there is no way to start a MacBook from a USB stick.

@Fraengii any luck with pressing C during boot? (#^https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201255)
If not, how about mounting and running a downloaded iso file? Would that be an option?

Fraengii

Sun, 21 May 2017 14:49:47 +0100

The C is for starting from CD. For to start from a different drive one have to press the ALT key.
Here is a description of how to prepair the stick for to boot a Linux live system from a stick on a mac:
#^How to Boot A Linux Live USB Stick On Your Mac

.
I havn't tryed it yet but it looks good.
Tell us about your experiences, @JRandal, and if you need help you're welcome!

Maria Karlsen

Sun, 21 May 2017 15:45:19 +0100 last edited: Sun, 21 May 2017 15:54:48 +0100

I replaced the video with a better quality one, for easier reading. (And added som music.)

JRandal

Sun, 21 May 2017 16:20:17 +0100

Thanks to you both. When I'm in a position to work on something, I'll keep you posted. And probably yell for help. :)

Fraengii

Sun, 21 May 2017 17:54:48 +0100

I replaced the video with a better quality one, for easier reading. (And added som music.)

Johann Strauss!!!

If thaught of Steve Strauss or at least Richard Strauss... but I've to admit it fits very well for this installation procedure and I like it.

Fraengii

Sun, 21 May 2017 18:00:11 +0100

#^Steve Strauss / Closer